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View Full Version : Latin prayer: US Jewish group finds Vatican statement ‘does not go far enough’


greektzon
04-06-2008, 08:05 PM
http://www.ejpress.org/article/25947

NEW YORK (EJP)---A leading US Jewish group said a statement by the Vatican reassuring Jews of the church’s commitment to a positive relationship with the Jewish people is “a welcome step.”
But it added that the statement “does not go far enough to allay concerns” about the introduction of a Latin prayer calling for the conversion of Jews.
The New York-based organization, which is fighting anti-Semitism in the world, echoed earlier comments from Jewish leaders, who last month criticized the pope for his refusal to abolish the prayer in the Latin mass on Good Friday, the day that commemorates the crucifixion and death of Jesus Christ.

"On this issue the Vatican has taken two steps forward and three steps backward," Abraham Foxman, ADL’s national director, said in a statement.
In advance of Pope Benedict XVI’s visit to the United States later this month, the Vatican issued last Friday a statement reaffirming the fundamental principles of Nostra Aetate, the landmark Second Vatican Council document that repudiates the concept of collective Jewish guilt for the death of Jesus.
It also said the re-introduction of the 1962 edition of the Roman Missal "in no way intends to indicate a change in the Catholic Church’s regard for the Jews which has evolved from the basis of the Second Vatican Council."

In its statement, the Holy See also stressed the "unique bond with which the people of the New Testament is spiritually linked with the stock of Abraham and rejects every attitude of contempt or discrimination against Jews. It said it firmly repudiated "any kind of anti-Semitism."
"It is reassuring that the Catholic Church remains committed to the ideals of Nostra Aetate and to an approach toward relations with the Jewish people based on cordiality and mutual respect, " Foxman said.

He added: “Yet it is troubling that the statement still does not specifically say that the Catholic Church is opposed to proselytizing Jews. While they say it does not change Nostra Aetate, the statement does not go far enough to allay concerns about how the message of this prayer will be understood by the people in the pews."
"The Latin prayer is still out there, and stands by itself, and unless this statement will be read along with the prayer, it will not repair or mitigate the impact of the words of the prayer itself, with its call for Jews to recognize Jesus as the savior of all men and its hope that ‘all Israel will be saved.’”

“The impact of those words is undeniable, and we wish the Vatican had explicitly rejected calls to conversion or to proselytizing Jews,” the ADL said.
The "Prayer for Jews" was dropped in the 1960s, but reappeared last year after Pope Benedict XVI restored the Latin Rite mass. It was toned down but retains the call for Jews to be converted.
During his US trip, the pope is scheduled to visit a New York synagogue and meet US Jewish leaders.

An Céachta Dearg
04-06-2008, 08:12 PM
The Catholic Church calls for the conversion of all religions so that they maybe saved from the fire of hell:mad:

Gareth
04-06-2008, 08:12 PM
Yes, I read this in that ultra Catholic newspaper I get in the door occasionally. Anyone else get it, "Alive" is the name of it. However I don't see how praying that Jews will find Christ is so offensive given our beliefs I guess. However singling out Jews alone is perhaps questionable.

donquixote99
04-06-2008, 08:16 PM
The Catholics think it thier religious duty to hope and pray for the conversion of all non-believers. According to thier beliefs, eternal punishment awaits non-believers after death. So by their lights, they are wishing well for the Jews.

Cultural chauvinism being what it is, the Jews don't appreciate it, but as long as most of what the Catholics do is pray about it, they don't have much to complain about.

Gareth
04-06-2008, 08:24 PM
I wish for mankind to find Christ also, may I add.

LARKIN32
04-06-2008, 09:55 PM
I wish for mankind to find Christ also, may I add.
hope you have good luck in that lad:D

Gareth
04-08-2008, 07:14 PM
Just wondering, if any of you think that it is unreasonable or even anti-Semitic to wish for the Jews to discover their own Messiah, what do you think of the Jews for Jesus group, who have been violently fought against legally and harassed by many for their ministry.

See: http://www.jewsforjesus.org/

Dreadfulfaery
04-11-2008, 03:44 PM
Why dont the rabbis just come up with a prayer calling for the convertion of all Catholics - to reject a false messiah??

Tit for tat and all that :p

Segep
04-11-2008, 03:47 PM
Just wondering, if any of you think that it is unreasonable or even anti-Semitic to wish for the Jews to discover their own Messiah,

I think it goes against the very nature of Judaism. We don't need a Messiah. The only one who can save us is ourselves. Relying on some Messiah is just avoiding our own responsibility, IMO.

what do you think of the Jews for Jesus group, who have been violently fought against legally and harassed by many for their ministry.

See: http://www.jewsforjesus.org/

I think they're a little bit whacked, but whatever floats their boat.

Gareth
04-11-2008, 03:53 PM
How come in Judaism there is a big emphasis on Messiah in the Tanakh then.

As much as you think they are "whacked", persecution of Messianic Jews and Christians in Israel is a serious problem, from ultra-Orthodox Jews in many cases.

Segep
04-11-2008, 03:58 PM
How come in Judaism there is a big emphasis on Messiah in the Tanakh then.

I don't know. I haven't really studied it enough to speculate. I only studied it for about a year, and my overall impression of the religion has been colored by the intellectual eccentricities of the Rabbi I studied under. I could probably spend 40 years studying it, and still not entirely understand it.

As much as you think they are "whacked", persecution of Messianic Jews and Christians in Israel is a serious problem, from ultra-Orthodox Jews in many cases.

I have no doubt about that. Extreme fundamentalism in any religion is dangerous and counter-productive, IMO.

Gareth
04-12-2008, 02:33 PM
I wouldn't go as far as saying that missionaries are dangerous and counter-productive.

LARKIN32
04-13-2008, 03:51 AM
much about organised religion in my view ,acts as the antithesis to spirituallity

bay
04-13-2008, 04:50 AM
I wouldn't go as far as saying that missionaries are dangerous and counter-productive.

Well they sure were to native cultures on this continent. but then again, they were very productive for the purpose of manifest destiny.

Segep
04-13-2008, 07:34 AM
I wouldn't go as far as saying that missionaries are dangerous and counter-productive.

Uh...did you even read what I wrote? I'm pretty sure the term I used was "Extreme fundamentalism", not "missionaries". For Pete's sake, they're not even close in meaning. One is an "ism", the other is a group of people.:rolleyes:

BlackBaron
04-15-2008, 11:36 PM
Yes, I read this in that ultra Catholic newspaper I get in the door occasionally. Anyone else get it, "Alive" is the name of it. However I don't see how praying that Jews will find Christ is so offensive given our beliefs I guess. However singling out Jews alone is perhaps questionable.

Alive is not ultra-Catholic.

Alive is pro-Novus Disordo.

http://www.remnantnewspaper.com/ That is an ultra Roman Catholic newspaper!