Chavez to discuss arms, banking deals in Moscow on July 21

[North Pole Resident]

Great news!
I hope our friend Hugo will build the anti-US military alliance in Latin America one day....

Chavez to discuss arms, banking deals in Moscow on July 21

17:19 | 18/ 07/ 2008

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/06cH4xq6nt3sJ/610x.jpg


MOSCOW, July 18 (RIA Novosti) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez will arrive in Moscow on July 21 to discuss military and economic ties with the Russian leadership, a Spanish news agency said on Friday, citing Venezuelan officials.
Hugo Chavez begins a six-nation tour on Friday that will take him to Bolivia, Nicaragua, Spain, Russia, Belarus and Portugal.
The Efe news agency said Chavez would discuss the purchase of military hardware, including battle tanks, and setting up a joint Russian-Venezuelan banking venture.
Commenting on the agenda of the visit, Konstantin Makiyenko, deputy director of the Russian Center for Strategic and Technological Analysis, said in an interview with RIA Novosti that,

"The sides may also discuss the purchase of Russian Project 636 Kilo-class diesel submarines, Tor-M1 air defense missile systems, and military transport planes."

Chavez earlier thanked Russia for providing easy-term loans to help modernize the Venezuelan Army. He pledged to continue military and technical cooperation, including the purchase of military hardware, such as Russian Sukhoi aircraft and helicopters.

Venezuela is a major purchaser of Russian weapons and hardware. In 2005-2006, Venezuela ordered weaponry from Russia worth $3.4 billion, including 24 Su-30MK2V Flanker fighters, Tor-M1 air defense missile systems, Mi-17B multi-role helicopters, Mi-35 Hind E attack helicopters, and Mi-26 Halo heavy transport helicopters.

The two countries have also prioritized cooperation in the energy and mining sectors. Russian gas monopoly Gazprom, the country's largest independent oil producer LUKoil, the Russian-British joint oil venture TNK-BP, aluminum giant RusAl and a number of other companies are active in the Venezuelan market.

In addition, Chavez has said he will discuss plans to set up a joint Russian-Venezuelan banking venture during his visit to Moscow.


READ MORE -- http://en.rian.ru/world/20080718/114373478.html

[North Pole Resident]

If the Emerican Empire thinks that it continue to piss on other nations and tell them that it's raining than it's time for a reality check....

Russian Su-30 in the sky of Venezuela


http://www.machtres.com/fav-su30-001.jpg


http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/su_30mk/images/Su-30MK_3.jpg

The Sukhoi Su-30 (NATO reporting name "Flanker-C") is an agile military aircraft developed by Russia's Sukhoi Aviation Corporation and introduced into operational service in 1996. It is a multi-role strike fighter that can perform both air superiority and ground attack missions.

The aircraft is a modernized version of the Su-27UB and has several variants. The Su-30K and Su-30MK series have had commercial success. The variants are manufactured by competing organizations: KNAAPO and the IRKUT Corporation, both of which come under the Sukhoi group's umbrella. KNAAPO manufactures the Su-30MKK and the Su-30MK2, which were designed for and sold to China. Irkut makes the long-range, multirole Su-30MK series. The series includes the Su-30MKI developed for the Indian Air Force and its derivatives, the MKM, MKA and MKV for Malaysia, Algeria and Venezuela respectively.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukhoi_Su-30


Su-30 para Venezuela

YouTube - Su-30 para Venezuela

[North Pole Resident]

Hugo Chavez’s visit to Russia triggers wave of Western criticism

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez arrives in Moscow with an official visit. The Venezuelans leader is going to discuss issues of arms shipments, the energy market cooperation, as well as questions regarding the establishment of a Russian-Venezuelan bank.

Chavez is said to meet Russian officials to discuss questions of purchasing Russian tanks and other military hardware for the needs of the Venezuelan Armed Forces.


http://img.rian.ru/images/9701/41/97014146.jpg

Russia's T-80 main battle tank

Hugo Chavez has been strengthening economic ties with other countries as well. The Venezuelan president urged members of the recent PetroCaribe summit to set up IMF-independent financial institutions with such countries as Russia, Belarus, China, India and Iran.

READ MORE -- http://english.pravda.ru/russia/economics/21-07-2008/105836-chavez_russia-0


The establishment of a Russian-Venezuelan bank is really good idea. :)

[North Pole Resident]

Russia and Venezuela plan to create one bank.

I think there is a big idea behind the creation of a Russian-Venezuelan bank. The Russian-Venezuelan bank might become the biggest bank in the world and will replace the World Bank.


Quote:

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez arrives in Moscow with an official visit. The Venezuelans leader is going to discuss issues of arms shipments, the energy market cooperation, as well as questions regarding the establishment of a Russian-Venezuelan bank.

http://english.pravda.ru/russia/economics/21-07-2008/105836-chavez_russia-0


From Guardian:

Venezuela quits IMF and World Bank

The Venezuelan president, Hugo Chávez, today severed ties with the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund.

In doing so he distanced Caracas further from what he described as Washington-dominated institutions.

The populist leader, who took office pledging to pursue radical political reform and an economic "third way", said yesterday that Venezuela no longer needed institutions "dominated by US imperialism".

Speaking at a May Day event, Mr Chávez said: "We don't need to be going up to Washington ... We are going to get out. I want to formalise our exit from the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund."

Venezuela has been loosening its ties to the IMF and the World Bank since Mr Chávez took office in 1999. Venezuela recently repaid its debts to the World Bank five years ahead of schedule. In doing so it saved $8m (£3.99m) and cleared all its debts to the IMF shortly after Mr Chávez was elected.

READ MORE -- http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2007/may/01/venezuela.imf

[ciaranxavier]

This is good for Venezuela.

[Drycon]

Well if they want out dated weapons I guess its good for them, its a shame, they could have spent that money on food for the poor.

[ciaranxavier]

if you read the articles theyre hardly outdated. and with USA's meddling it is essential to have some form of defense. All the US funded guerillas in South America need to be repelled and you can bet theres some going after Hugos government.

[Drycon]

They are outdated, 4th gen fighters in a 5th gen world. The tanks might be great, but when your talking about a war, they are taken out from the sky anyway.

In over 100 simulated fights the f22 has never lost to the su 30, and thats a huge a feat this day in age, and thats why I call it out dated, not to mention that russian missles are about 13 years behind nato's, so even the f-16s and f-15s would handle the su 30 from beyond visual range. IF they got in a turning close range dog fight, the su 30 would have the upper hand becuase of its flight control surfaces and thrust vectoring, alas the su30 will never get in a close range fight with an american 4th gen fighter because they have no stealth and sub par avionics.

[ciaranxavier]

you must remember that russias not so willing to show the full might they have, id say theyre just as caught up as US or NATO is.

[Drycon]

They sell su-30s to everyone, and the us has atleast one from a purchase with india.

The su-30 is at best a great airshow machine. The russians are working on a 5th gen fighter now but it wont be ready for 4 more years or so. Even they know they are behind the curve.

Russia is WAY behind nato, they have over a decade of makeing up to do, and when your talking about things like the f22 wich leap frogs(the f22 was a design meant to be done in 2020) forward, the russians have a long up hill battle.

[ciaranxavier]

i doubt it IMO.

[Drycon]

i doubt it IMO.

Doubt what?

Everyone is welcome to think what they will but I will take the word of military analysts world wide, wich disagree with your unfounded opinion.

[ciaranxavier]

I just know the russians arent stupid and i doubt theyve allowed themselves to fall far behind if behind at all. theyre just better at keeping their lips sealed.

[Drycon]

The russians are not stupid, but they have not had the budget to delve in to weapon building until recently, also, historicly the russians are rather loose lipped about weapons, and also make them out to be more then they really are, cuban missle crisis anyone?

The US is the one that hides new weapons, and tells the public about them after they have been used in combat, IE:the stealth.

[North Pole Resident]

The best way to keep American Empire away is to create the anti-US military alliance in Latin America.


17:02 | 24/ 07/ 2008


Venezuela to buy more weaponry from Russia

http://kremlin.ru/dyn_images/big204427.jpg

July 22, 2008
MEIENDORF CASTLE, MOSCOW REGION. Russian-Venezuelan talks.

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MOSCOW, July 24 (RIA Novosti) -- Venezuela may purchase man-portable air defense systems, Il-76 transport planes and T-90 tanks from Russian in the near future, a Russian political analyst said Thursday.
According to unofficial reports, Russia and Venezuela signed a new framework agreement Wednesday on delivery of Russian air defense systems, tanks and military transport planes to the Latin American country.

"The new agreement, most likely, involves purchases of Igla man-portable air defense systems, Il-76MD military transport planes and T-90 main battle tanks," said Ruslan Pukhov, director of the Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies.

Pukhov has estimated that Venezuela could spend $5 billion or more over the next 10 years on Russian military equipment.

He said that after the Swedish Saab announced in 2006 it could not continue sales of portable anti-aircraft systems to Venezuela because of a U.S. arms embargo against President Hugo Chavez's government, Russian Igla missiles became the obvious choice for the Venezuelan army.

According to Pukhov, Venezuela could be interested in the purchase of Russian T-90 main battle tanks because of the excellent value for money they provide.

A spokesman for Uralvagonzavod, a Urals-based manufacturer of T-90s, said the Russian tanks are superior to foreign models of the same class in terms of firepower, maneuverability, speed and armor protection, but sell for almost half the price.

The Uralvagonzavod official said, though, that the plant would have to operate at full capacity to meet outstanding orders, so it would be a few years before the company was able to produce tanks under a new foreign contract.

In 2005-2006, Venezuela bought more than 50 combat helicopters, 24 Su-30MK2 fighters, 12 Tor-M1 air defense missile systems and 100,000 AK-103 rifles from Russia. Current contracts are worth about $4 billion, according to various sources.

Wednesday's reported deal could see Russia become the main supplier of military equipment to Venezuela. Chavez, an outspoken critic of Washington, has focused his foreign policy on bolstering ties with countries outside the U.S. sphere of influence since coming to power nine years ago.

http://en.rian.ru/russia/20080724/114840335.html

[Drycon]

So when is Chavez's re election happening? I'm wondering if he is gearing up on weapons so that he does not have to hold an election, or a fair one (or not leave office after loseing)anyway. Because if he is armed he may think the US would not come in and pull a regime change.

I'm not saying Chavez would lose, but we know he wants to be a dictator, and haveing a strong army is a sure fire way of getting to that end

[Nijinsky]

but we know he wants to be a dictator

:eek: We do? Since when? When did this happen?

[ciaranxavier]

So when is Chavez's re election happening? I'm wondering if he is gearing up on weapons so that he does not have to hold an election, or a fair one (or not leave office after loseing)anyway. Because if he is armed he may think the US would not come in and pull a regime change.

I'm not saying Chavez would lose, but we know he wants to be a dictator, and haveing a strong army is a sure fire way of getting to that end

he cant run for re election. and he voted for that and narrowly lost which he took with no problem and agreed to step down at the end of his term. so whats all you dictatorship crap about?

[Nijinsky]

he cant run for re election. and he voted for that and narrowly lost which he took with no problem and agreed to step down at the end of his term. so whats all you dictatorship crap about?

Its precisely that Ciaran - crap

[ciaranxavier]

Its precisely that Ciaran - crap

well how does it tie into hugo, there is no dictatorship their. theres a gov. ran democratically.

[Drycon]

Did he not hold a vote to make him president for life? I know he lost, but with a strong army he wouldnt have to step down.

[ciaranxavier]

Did he not hold a vote to make him president for life? I know he lost, but with a strong army he wouldnt have to step down.

he took a vote, he also humbly accepted the outcome. Now america has a strong army does that mean Bush plans to keep power?? Is bush a dictatorship because of what he "may" do??

[Drycon]

he took a vote, he also humbly accepted the outcome. Now america has a strong army does that mean Bush plans to keep power?? Is bush a dictatorship because of what he "may" do??

Bush never tryed to be president for life, that I know of.

[ciaranxavier]

so basically your accusations are unfounded good enough for me.

[Drycon]

so basically your accusations are unfounded good enough for me.


It was mearly a theory, not an accusation. It is POSSIBLE this is why he is arming up, there is no concrete proof that this is not a possiblity.

I know its trendy to be anti-anti communist, but I could not care less about socialism.

[ciaranxavier]

It was mearly a theory, not an accusation. It is POSSIBLE this is why he is arming up, there is no concrete proof that this is not a possiblity.

I know its trendy to be anti-anti communist, but I could not care less about socialism.

the fact is they need weapons to keep the US funded guerillas out of power.

[Drycon]

the fact is they need weapons to keep the US funded guerillas out of power.


No doubt, but it still does not absolutely prove my theory not possible.

[Nijinsky]

Drycon Did he not hold a vote to make him president for life?


No he didnt Drycon. You should follow things more closely and it would save you the embarrassment of making bogus accusations and being caught out

[Drycon]

So he did not try to try to make a constitutional admendment to be rid of presidental term limits in nov of 2007? So how am I caught out again?

Sure sounds like president for life to me, I meen sure we would have some elections, farce or not, but its not a stretch to belive he would follow in the path of other socialists leaders and just stay in office.

[Nijinsky]

Drycon: So he did not try to try to make a constitutional admendment to be rid of presidental term limits in nov of 2007?

He did. It would not have made him President for life. He, like any ther candidate would still have to run and be elected. There are no term limits here in Ireland or in England or in many many other countries. Are tehy all dictatorships too?


Drycon So how am I caught out again?

Because you claimed he had a referendum to try to make himself President for Life. He didnt

[Drycon]

Drycon:

He did. It would not have made him President for life. He, like any ther candidate would still have to run and be elected. There are no term limits here in Ireland or in England or in many many other countries. Are tehy all dictatorships too?




How many of those are currently socialist? Compareing the western world to the third world is hardly fair, apples and oranges. Would it not be fair to compare his aspirations similar to castro?

[Slap]

Chavez has refused to protect property rights, reneged contracts he didn't like, and undermined freedom of the press. He's on Castro's track, who didn't admit he was a Communist until he'd consolidated power.

How is Chavez diverging from Castro's path to totalitarianism?

What would Chavez have to do short of admitting that he's an aspiring Communist tyrant, to get any of his defenders here to take the hint? Even if they knew, would they acknowledge it?

I suspect that even if Chavez refuses to step down at the end of his term (either declaring a state of emergency or indefinitely postponing any election for his successor) his defenders will parrot his propaganda, and refuse to acknowledge that he's an aspiring tyrant.

There is a pattern at work in Venezuela, that shouldn't surprise anyone. Luckily for the people of Venezuela, its a lot easier to escape than from an island like Cuba.

[Slap]

The sooner Chavez mismanages Venezuela's oil production in to decline, and blows the proceeds on Soviet toys, the sooner he'll show his hand. I don't think he'll last as long as Castro did.

[Nijinsky]

How many of those are currently socialist? Compareing the western world to the third world is hardly fair, apples and oranges. Would it not be fair to compare his aspirations similar to castro?

No,. You have claimed, falsely, that he had a referendum to make him president for life. That was false, untrue. He didnt. He held a vote to end term limits, as many many other countries around the world do, which he lost and which he accepted defeat in. He still would have, along with other candidates have had to copntest re election if he wanted to remain in power. In other words it would be up to the people to decide. Do you think thats wrong, to let the people decide?

What difference do term limits make whether in Europe or south america or anywhere else for that matter?