The Holocaust dogma

[Rehmat]

One doesn’t need to hide a truth, it always finds a way to shine. In order to kill the truth behind the ‘Holocaust’ myth – Israelis and Zionist mafia around the world has come-up with various means to keep it shining – from mass propaganda through press and internet; Hollywood movies; hounding intellectuals who challenge their lies; Holocaust Education Foundation, which spread those lies in the US universities; free-trips to Holocaust museums and to Poland’s “Holy Sites’ - and putting western itellectuals who challenge this dogma into jails in France, Germany, Australia, Israel, etc.

While public schools in both the US and Canada don’t teach Christianity or Islam – public schools in several American States are forced to teach Holocaust.

http://www.ideajournal.com/articles.php?id=41

[CoolockRepublican]

REHMAT to deny the jewish holocaust is only highlighting your brainwashed indoctrinated fanaticism,it is a fact that the holocaust happened and it is against the law in germany to deny it happened,you are nothing but a fool.

[Rehmat]

Hey Zionist CREEP...how about this one....

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/antisemitism/holocaust/index.cfm

And remember, according to your hateful Talmud - Whoever disobey Rabbis - will burn in Hell-fire forever.

[quirk]

Hey Zionist CREEP...how about this one....

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/antisemitism/holocaust/index.cfm

And remember, according to your hateful Talmud - Whoever disobey Rabbis - will burn in Hell-fire forever.

You have provided a source here which quotes individuals about the holocaust. Such comments could be found amongst all people of different races. I also find it weird that you have provided this source at all as according to your first post the holocaust is a myth.

[Rehmat]

I provided the link because anyone who challenges the Holocaust dogma - is immediately called "Jew hater", "anti-Semite", "self-hating Jew", etc. etc. However, according to Talmud - Whoever disobey Rabbis, will burn in Hell forever" - which could shut a Jew hacker.

Did you know that there are more Holocaust survivors now than at the end of WW II?

Read Teacher’s Guide to the Holocaust:

http://fcit.usf.edu/Holocaust/people/survivor.htm

A French Professor, Robert Faurisson, claims to have read thousands of pages of memoirs of World War 2 from Eisenhower, Churchill, and de Gaulle, and there was not a single word about gas chambers:

http://www.vho.org/aaargh/engl/FaurisArch/RF981020.html

[ciaranxavier]

I provided the link because anyone who challenges the Holocaust dogma - is immediately called "Jew hater", "anti-Semite", "self-hating Jew", etc. etc. However, according to Talmud - Whoever disobey Rabbis, will burn in Hell forever" - which could shut a Jew hacker.

Did you know that there are more Holocaust survivors now than at the end of WW II?

Read Teacher’s Guide to the Holocaust:

http://fcit.usf.edu/Holocaust/people/survivor.htm

A French Professor, Robert Faurisson, claims to have read thousands of pages of memoirs of World War 2 from Eisenhower, Churchill, and de Gaulle, and there was not a single word about gas chambers:

http://www.vho.org/aaargh/engl/FaurisArch/RF981020.html

Did you know that there are more Holocaust survivors now than at the end of WW II?

that would make sense as a lot of people wouldve come out in the months after WW2 as being escapees or people hiding in homes.

A French Professor, Robert Faurisson, claims to have read thousands of pages of memoirs of World War 2 from Eisenhower, Churchill, and de Gaulle, and there was not a single word about gas chambers:

3 peoples memoirs is enough to wipe away the testimonies of millions of people including non jews, come back to reality even germans have testified to the atrocities that were committed. and the proof is in front of your eyes if you really bothered to look still sitting there for the world to see, testiments to the atrocities that happened. left there so people like you cant dispute the fact that it happened. dispute the numbers all you want but please dont mock the dead by denying the fact that millions of people died unwarranted deaths in an unjustified war.

[socrates]

The gas chambers were not known about until after the war so it would be strange if wartime memoirs mentioned them unless they were the memoirs of cam guards. The holocaust is one of the best recorded events in all of history and to deny it is crazy in my opinion.

[ciaranxavier]

The gas chambers were not known about until after the war so it would be strange if wartime memoirs mentioned them unless they were the memoirs of cam guards. The holocaust is one of the best recorded events in all of history and to deny it is crazy in my opinion.

exactly, disputing the facts is one thing (ie- the actual number murdered) but denying it outright is just naive and pigheaded.

[quirk]

I agree. The facts and numbers should always be questioned - nothing should be sacred. If here is evidence to dispute the numbers then I would like to see it and decide for myself.

Rehmat, do you dispute that it took place at all?

[Rehmat]

Aha....someone wants to shove Zionist lies here too!!!

I suggest he/she joined the Zionist vultures currently ganging on Rehmat at:

http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?t=159900

[ciaranxavier]

Aha....someone wants to shove Zionist lies here too!!!

I suggest he/she joined the Zionist vultures currently ganging on Rehmat at:

http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?t=159900

stop calling people who debate you zionists please. and why dont you answer the question at hand i really dont care about your other debates on other forums. and the question is.

do you believe the holocaust ever happened at all??

[quirk]

I think we should take this opportunity to have a serious and civil debate about the holocaust. I don't agree with your view on this Rehmat but lets see the evidence then we can discuss it and see it our views converge a little.

[Enver]

I visited Auschwitz-Birkenau exactly 2 years ago today. No amount of History Channel documentaries; photographs in books or on websites can replace experiencing an extermination camp in the flesh. It was a very bad winter that year in Eastern Europe (it was about minus ten the day we visited the camp). The harsh weather really rams it home. I highly recommend visiting during the thick of winter. I wouldn't consider myself a particularly emotional person, but try and stand inside a gas chamber or furnace with scratch marks all over the walls without your stomach churning.

The Holocaust (and let's not forget the millions of Gypsies, Soviet POWs, people with physical and learning disabilities and homosexuals who also died in these camps) was very much real and to deny it is to do a grave injustice to the memory of these people.

[donquixote99]

Rehmat, you're completely Nazi in spirit--not becuase you deny the Holocaust, different people do that for different reasons, but because your 'debate' method is pure attack and mock. This marks you as the moral heir of the sociopathic Nazi movement.

You're gravely wrong about everything, btw. You may have hold of a half-truth here and there, but most of your 'facts' are complete BS.

And no, I am not intersted in discussing particulars with you. I could demonstrate exactly how wrong you are, and you would be totally immune to my logic and facts. Been there, done that. You are much too invested in your belief structure to be worth debating.

Have an appropriate life.

[Phædrus]

Rehmat? I remember him. He got banned at Political Fever for trolling and baiting. He's a Grade A asshole, no doubt about it. He goes from board to board spamming, insulting, and spreading hate. In fact, his username is an anagram for "Mr. Hate."

I reccommend an immediate ban.

[Dreadfulfaery]

Hey im new here but im going to get stuck in.

For all the people who deny the Haulocaust took place - what about all the photographs off the mass graves? You know, the ones with the piles and piles off emaciated DEAD people.
Or does your conspiracy theorise that somehow the Allies managed to get hundreds of people to voluntaerily starve themselves and then pose for the piccies??

[Gareth]

It's clear that anyone in this day and age who denies the Holocaust and the Armenian Genocide needs to consult the facts.

[Viv]

Yeah Phaedrus, Rehmat is gone from here also. He did not seem interested in posting anything but this agenda as was the case in our other forum.

I agree, there is overwhelming evidence regarding the holocaust. People try to sow seeds of doubt with this kind of OP in order to support their own view, but it is beyond debate IMO.

Ayrie Faery, welcome to the forum :D Another Scot aboard is always a good thing ;)

[Al Fatiha]

Here is a great site with a ton of information about the "Holocaust Hoax".

http://www.adelaideinstitute.org/Auschwitz/truth.htm

[Gareth]

What evidence is there that there was a University there. And how do you account for the fact that several million Jews vanished into thin air by 1945.

[Al Fatiha]

What evidence is there that there was a University there. And how do you account for the fact that several million Jews vanished into thin air by 1945.That's just a Zionist "fact".

[Gareth]

What purpose do you think Auschwitz had then? A childrens playground?

[Al Fatiha]

What purpose do you think Auschwitz had then? A childrens playground?Go to the site I provided and scroll to the bottom. Your question will be answered.

[Gareth]

That doesn't answer my question to why the Jews were put there if not to be exterminated. You deny that there were gas chambers in Auschwitz?

Edit: we're not only talking about Auschwitz, we are talking about several camps.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/WW2-Holocaust-Europe-2007Borders.png

[Al Fatiha]

MAJOR HISTORICAL FACT UNCOVERED.

Shocking Auschwitz Testimony.

What was the most important historical event of 1992? Don't
answer until you've read this story.

Exclusive to The Spotlight.
By Samuel P. Foner.
----------------------------------------

The director of Auschwitz has been filmed on videotape*
[footnote to article follows: * David Cole's video is on VHS for
$49; available from Liberty Library, 300 Independence Ave. SE,
Washington, D.C. 20003. The Leuchter report, $20, from IHR, P.O.
Box 2739, Newport Beach, CA 92659.] admitting that the so-called
gas chamber there was constructed after the war.

In a dramatic and unprecedented filmed interview, Dr.
Franciszek Piper, senior curator and director of archives at the
Auschwitz State Museum, admits on camera that "Krema I," the
alleged "homicidal gas chamber" shown off to hundreds of
thousands of tourists every year at the Auschwitz main camp, is,
in fact, a reconstruction, fabricated after the war by the
Soviet Union - apparently on the direct orders of dictator Josef
Stalin.

What Piper said, in effect - and on camera - was that the
explosive Leuchter Report was correct: No homicidal gassings
took place in the buildings designated "homicidal gas chambers"
at Auschwitz.

Ironically, for someone to even suggest such a thing could bring a jail
sentence in more than one country - including
enlightened nations like France, Canada and Germany. (Just ask
Ernst Zundel. But more about him later.)

'FACTS' ARE LIES
With this admission by none other than the responsible head of
the Auschwitz State Museum, one of the most scared "facts" of
history has been destroyed. It is the major historical "fact"
on which the foreign and domestic policies of all of the Western
nations since World War II are based.

It is the basis for the $100 billion in foreign aid the United
States has poured into the state of Israel since its inception
in 1948 - amounting to $16,500 for every man, woman and child in
the Jewish state and billions more paid by (West) Germany in
"reparations" - not to mention the constructing of Israel's
national telephone, electrical and rail systems, gifts of the
German people. It is the basis for the $10 billion "loan") read
"gift") made to Israel for housing immigrants in occupied
territories, while Americans sleep on streets and businesses are
bankrupted by the thousands.

Germany is paying "reparations" - and the United States is making major
contributions - to atone for the "gassings at
Auschwitz" and elsewhere. If the "homicidal gas chambers" were
postwar creations, in which no one was gassed regardless of
race, creed, color or country of national origin, then those
"reparations " were unnecessary, and were based on fraud.

The videotape on which Piper makes his revelations was taken
in mid-1992 by a young Jewish investigator, David Cole. It has
just been released, on January 1, 1993, although Cole announced
his project at the 11th International Revisionist Conference at
Irvine, California last October.

Cole's production follows 12 years of intensive investigation
by dozens of historians, journalists and scientists who have
tried to get to the bottom of what really happened at Auschwitz.

In 1979, the Institute for Historical Review (IHR) was founded
which coordinated these investigations in an effort to "bring
history into accord with the facts." Since then the IHR has
published dozens of papers and books, none of which has ever
been refuted, concerning various aspects of the "holocaust."

A major aspect that has been investigated concerns the gas
chamber theory, and the biggest and the biggest [sic] and
busiest gas chamber was supposedly at Auschwitz.

The activities of the IHR have been so controversial that on
the night of July 4, 1984, after two years of harassment and
vandalism, it was burnt to the ground by Israeli agents.
Miraculously it was able to continue operations after some
months of inactivity.

INSTRUCTED FROM YOUTH
Like most Americans, since his youth Cole had been instructed
in the "irrefutable fact" that homicidal gassings had taken
place at Auschwitz. The number of those so executed - also
declared irrefutable - was 4.1 million.

Then came the Leuchter Report in 1988. This was followed by a
"re-evaluation" of the total deaths at Auschwitz (down to 1.1
million). As a budding historian - and a Jew - Cole was
intrigued.

Previous to 1992, anyone who publicly doubted the 4.1 million
"gassing" deaths at Auschwitz was labeled an anti-Semite,
neo-nazi skinhead (at the very least). Quietly, because of
revisionist findings, the official figure was lowered to 1.1
million. No mention of that missing 3 million.

In 1988, Ernst Zundel was put on trial in Canada for
"publishing false news." He sold a book which questioned the
legitimacy of the Auschwitz gas chamber.

Helping with the defense were internationally known historians
including Robert Faurisson, David Irving and Mark Weber.
Zundel went looking for an expert on executions, particularly
gassings. He found Leuchter, who specializes in the design and
fabrication of execution hardware used in prisons throughout the
United States. Leuchter was commissioned to visit Poland and
conduct a scientific examination of the so-called homicidal gas
chambers.

On February 25, 1988, Leuchter left for Poland together with
his wife Carolyn, his draftsman Howard Miller, cinematographer
Jurgen Neumann and Polish interpreter Theodor Rudolph. They
returned on March 3. Then he wrote his controversial report.

NO GAS CHAMBERS
His conclusion were clear: The evidence was overwhelming that
there were no execution chambers at Auschwitz, Birkenau and
Majdanek and that the alleged gas chambers at these sites could
not have been, then or now, utilized or seriously considered to
function as execution gas chambers.

[Gareth]

Can you reply yourself instead of spamming articles?

[An Céachta Dearg]

Here is a great site with a ton of information about the "Holocaust Hoax".

http://www.adelaideinstitute.org/Auschwitz/truth.htm

The holocaust Hoax!!!

What the Fuck

So 6 million people just disapeared out of europe during world war two enexplained then did they. Autswich and Dacua are jsut their for show are they.

The people the Ally soldiers found in those camps were just communal dieters were they


Al this is below low You are no better than a Nazi

[Al Fatiha]

The holocaust Hoax!!!

What the Fuck

So 6 million people just disapeared out of europe during world war two enexplained then did they. Autswich and Dacua are jsut their for show are they.

The people the Ally soldiers found in those camps were just communal dieters were they


Al this is below low You are no better than a NaziWhere there consentration camps? Yes

Where people used as slave labor? Yes?

Where people killed who could function at the camps? Yes


Was 6 million actually the correct figure for those who died at the camps? No

Where the camps set up for mass extemination? No


RedPlough that's what get's me. If a person questions the holocaust. They are automatically called a Nazi and an anti-semite.

Why can't the holocaust be open for discussion without name calling?

[Gareth]

What so they served as luxury hotel suites exclusively for the Jews? :rolleyes:

[Lightweaver]

So "The Diary of Ann Frank" was a hoax? The book "Auschwitz" which described the horrors in details was a hoax? I don't think so.

I find it shocking that anyone would believe these atrocities didn't happen and that the whole idea of the Holocaust is a hoax. I just cannot comprehend that mind set...:cool:

[Al Fatiha]

So "The Diary of Ann Frank" was a hoax? The book "Auschwitz" which described the horrors in details was a hoax? I don't think so.

I find it shocking that anyone would believe these atrocities didn't happen and that the whole idea of the Holocaust is a hoax. I just cannot comprehend that mind set...:cool:
The "Holocaust Industry" is nothing but a fantasy used by the Zionist to legitimize the rouge state of Israel, and has become a cash cow to further their fascist political agenda.

[Gareth]

So Auschwitz was effectively a 5 star hotel for Jews then? Wow Hitler wasn't anti-Semitic at all then?

[Lightweaver]

The "Holocaust Industry" is nothing but a fantasy used by the Zionist to legitimize the rouge state of Israel, and has become a cash cow to further their fascist political agenda.

LOL! OK, I understand. :rolleyes: :D

[ciaranxavier]

The "Holocaust Industry" is nothing but a fantasy used by the Zionist to legitimize the rouge state of Israel, and has become a cash cow to further their fascist political agenda.

where the hell do you get off saying the camps never existed though? its fact that they existed and its fact they they murdered more then just jews in those camps. you can argue the numbers all you want but there is no way in hell you can deny their existence especially if youve visited the remnants of those death factories today.

[ciaranxavier]

LOL! OK, I understand. :rolleyes: :D

welcome lightweaver.

[Al Fatiha]

where the hell do you get off saying the camps never existed though? its fact that they existed and its fact they they murdered more then just jews in those camps. you can argue the numbers all you want but there is no way in hell you can deny their existence especially if youve visited the remnants of those death factories today.I never said that the places didn't exist.

I just said that they were work camps.

Not extermination camps.

[ciaranxavier]

I never said that the places didn't exist.

I just said that they were work camps.

Not extermination camps.

and again every historical record would prove you wrong. there was extermination camps and there were jews murdered in the thousands. your not wrong by saying there were work camps as there was work camps. but to deny the fact that there were camps set aside to kill large numbers of people (not just jews) is a fact that cant be denied as you can still visit the gas chambers and the crematoriums today. though i doubt youve ever visited one considering your narrow minded perspective used most often by vile bigots.

[Al Fatiha]

and again every historical record would prove you wrong. there was extermination camps and there were jews murdered in the thousands. your not wrong by saying there were work camps as there was work camps. but to deny the fact that there were camps set aside to kill large numbers of people (not just jews) is a fact that cant be denied as you can still visit the gas chambers and the crematoriums today. though i doubt youve ever visited one considering your narrow minded perspective used most often by vile bigots.Why the name calling?

I just came to discuss the issues. Where there some "small" number of jews killed at the camps? I am sure there were.

Where homosexuals purged from their society. Thankfully, Yes!

But I don't believe that was the main purpose of the camps.

The Germans needed labor, and the traitorous jews provided the majority of that labor.

[ciaranxavier]

Why the name calling?

I just came to discuss the issues. Where there some "small" number of jews killed at the camps? I am sure there were.

Where homosexuals purged from their society. Thankfully, Yes!

But I don't believe that was the main purpose of the camps.

The Germans needed labor, and the traitorous jews provided the majority of that labor.

Why the name calling?

i calls em as i sees em.


I just came to discuss the issues. Where there some "small" number of jews killed at the camps? I am sure there were.

no there were thousands. killed for no other reason then their religious orientation.


Where homosexuals purged from their society. Thankfully, Yes!

and you ask why i call you names such as bigot.

But I don't believe that was the main purpose of the camps.

of the extermination camps yes that was the main purpose. the labor camps no. but the extermination camps its quite obvious it was. why else would there be ovens and gas chambers.

The Germans needed labor, and the traitorous jews provided the majority of that labor.

germany forced labor for a pointless war. and the jews who unless you have evidence i dont know why you call them traitors were singled out unfairly.

[Al Fatiha]

and the jews who unless you have evidence i dont know why you call them traitors were singled out unfairly.During WWI the Jewish bankers sold out the German people and caused the defeat of Germany.

The German people knew this and it caused wide spread anti semitism.

[donquixote99]

Here is a great site with a ton of information about the "Holocaust Hoax".

http://www.adelaideinstitute.org/Auschwitz/truth.htm


Here's a great site with an ton of information about the Holocaust fact.

That audio of the Himmler speech would seem to present a lot of problems for deniers....

http://www.holocaust-history.org/

[ciaranxavier]

During WWI the Jewish bankers sold out the German people and caused the defeat of Germany.

The German people knew this and it caused wide spread anti semitism.

why else would there be ovens and gas chambers.

[Al Fatiha]

Here's a great site with an ton of information about the Holocaust fact.

That audio of the Himmler speech would seem to present a lot of problems for deniers....

http://www.holocaust-history.org/So what's your point?

The Nazi's didn't like the Jews and wanted them out of Germany or put into camps.

I don't deny this.

I just deny the 6 million figure and the so called extermination camps.

[Gareth]

Calling the Jews traitors would be a form of anti-Semitism. Some Jews have brought Germans success. Franz Kafka (writer), Theodor Herzl (journalist and coined Zionism, even if you disagree with this he was successful), and Karl Marx (ethnically Jewish) being just 3.

[ciaranxavier]

So what's your point?

The Nazi's didn't like the Jews and wanted them out of Germany or put into camps.

I don't deny this.

I just deny the 6 million figure and the so called extermination camps.

so how many died oh enlightened one?? tell us the numbers you think were exterminated??? or were they all fed well in the "labor camps"

[Al Fatiha]

Calling the Jews traitors would be a form of anti-Semitism. Some Jews have brought Germans success. Franz Kafka (writer), Theodor Herzl (journalist and coined Zionism, even if you disagree with this he was successful), and Karl Marx (ethnically Jewish) being just 3.Karl Marx!?!?

He was the spiritual godfather of Communism, which cost tens of millions of people their lives around the world.

Kafka was a mental case.

And because of Theodor Hezl and his fascist philosophy, the rogues state of Israel was formed, causing untold numbers of deaths and modern day choas in the middle east.

No wonder the Jews were reviled in Germany!!!

[ciaranxavier]

Karl Marx!?!?

He was the spiritual godfather of Communism, which cost tens of millions of people their lives around the world.

Kafka was a mental case.

And because of Theodor Hezl and his fascist philosophy, the rogues state of Israel was formed, causing untold numbers of deaths and modern day choas in the middle east.

No wonder the Jews were reviled in Germany!!!

He was the spiritual godfather of Communism, which cost tens of millions of people their lives around the world.

marx had ideologies that the communists used he is in no way the person to blame for crimes committed by those who claimed to follow his teachings.


No wonder the Jews were reviled in Germany!!!

why were they??? have you ever seen the concentration camps?? or is your view that of a pigheaded uninformed ignoramus?

[Al Fatiha]

so how many died oh enlightened one?? tell us the numbers you think were exterminated??? or were they all fed well in the "labor camps"
At the very, very most, one million.

www.whatreallyhappened.com/holofour

[donquixote99]

So what's your point?

The Nazi's didn't like the Jews and wanted them out of Germany or put into camps.

I don't deny this.

I just deny the 6 million figure and the so called extermination camps.

If you looked into the Himmler speech, you'd find he was exhorting the SS men to be strong to do the psychologically taxing work of killing, to be 'tactful,' that is, silent about it, and not to steal anything but loyally insure all the loot flowed to the state. He explicitly refers to extermiination and killing. He is not refering to a forced labor program.

But I believe you have integrated a web of beliefs in this area that supports your identity and ego, and you're quite unlikely to change them anytime soon. Perhaps at a later stage of your life. For now, believe what you need to believe.

[Al Fatiha]

[B]

why were they??? have you ever seen the concentration camps?? or is your view that of a pigheaded uninformed ignoramus?


Why can't you just debate the topic without resorting to this infantile name calling?

[Al Fatiha]

But I believe you have integrated a web of beliefs in this area that supports your identity and ego, and you're quite unlikely to change them anytime soon. Perhaps at a later stage of your life. For now, believe what you need to believe.
I don't NEED to believe like you, just to believe.

I go by the hard core facts!

Unpopular, but the Truth!

[Gareth]

In relation to Zionism I think all anti-Semitic Germans would have been happy that the Jews were making plans to get out, which stumps your argument that Zionism caused anti-Semitism in Germany.

[An Céachta Dearg]

Karl Marx!?!?

He was the spiritual godfather of Communism, which cost tens of millions of people their lives around the world.

No wonder the Jews were reviled in Germany!!!
Do not dare to drag Karl Marx's name throught the dirt. The man was a genius as a philosopher and of political commentry who wrote many great books and letters. Try reading Das Capital and the German Letters. Also before you disms Marx actually read the communist Manifesto and you will realise that the Soviet Union were State Capitalists and not actually either communist.

Actually you are wrong the Jews were only despised initially by anti-semites i Germany. However because of a Certain Austrian who became the leader of the National Socialist Party(Oxymoron term there) who was himself an anti-semite. He led a propaganda campaign against the Jews which was spear headed by the media genius Albert Speares who himself said he was not anti-Semite but still led the Nazi campaign V the Jews. Therefore theGerman population needed a scape goat over the Versailles treaty and easily found blame for the Jews as a way of venting frustration and of course they were brainwashed by the Nazi adminstartion.

[quirk]

In relation to Zionism I think all anti-Semitic Germans would have been happy that the Jews were making plans to get out, which stumps your argument that Zionism caused anti-Semitism in Germany.

Indeed the Nazi's originally planned to simply extradite all the Jews from Europe. Madagascar was discussed as a possible location. It was only with the beginning of war which made this impossible that the "final solution" became policy.

[Al Fatiha]

109 Locations whence Jews have been Expelled since AD250

YEAR . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . PLACE

250 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Carthage
415 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Alexandria
554 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Diocese of Clement (France)
561 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Diocese of Uzzes (France)
612 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Visigoth Spain
642 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Visigoth Empire
855 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Italy
876 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Sens
1012 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Mainz
1182 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - France
1182 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Germany
1276 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Upper Bavaria
1290 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - England
1306 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - France
1322 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - France (again)
1348 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Switzerland
1349 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hielbronn (Germany)
1349 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Saxony
1349 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hungary
1360 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hungary
1370 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Belgium
1380 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Slovakia
1388 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Strasbourg
1394 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Germany
1394 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - France
1420 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Lyons
1421 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Austria
1424 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Fribourg
1424 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Zurich
1424 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Cologne
1432 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Savoy
1438 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Mainz
1439 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Augsburg
1442 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Netherlands
1444 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Netherlands
1446 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bavaria
1453 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - France
1453 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Breslau
1454 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Wurzburg
1462 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Mainz
1483 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Mainz
1484 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Warsaw
1485 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Vincenza (Italy)
1492 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Spain
1492 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Italy
1495 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Lithuania
1496 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Naples
1496 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Portugal
1498 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Nuremberg
1498 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Navarre
1510 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brandenberg
1510 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Prussia
1514 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Strasbourg
1515 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Genoa
1519 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Regensburg
1533 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Naples
1541 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Naples
1542 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Prague & Bohemia
1550 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Genoa
1551 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bavaria
1555 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Pesaro
1557 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Prague
1559 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Austria
1561 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Prague
1567 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Wurzburg
1569 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Papal States
1571 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brandenburg
1582 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Netherlands
1582 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hungary
1593 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brandenburg, Austria
1597 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Cremona, Pavia & Lodi
1614 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Frankfort
1615 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Worms
1619 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Kiev
1648 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Ukraine
1648 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Poland
1649 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hamburg
1654 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Little Russia (Beylorus)
1656 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Lithuania
1669 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Oran (North Africa)
1669 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Vienna
1670 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Vienna
1712 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Sandomir
1727 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Russia
1738 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Wurtemburg
1740 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Little Russia (Beylorus)
1744 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Prague, Bohemia
1744 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Slovakia
1744 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Livonia
1745 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Moravia
1753 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Kovad (Lithuania)
1761 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bordeaux
1772 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Deported to the Pale of Settlement (Poland/Russia)
1775 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Warsaw
1789 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Alsace
1804 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Villages in Russia
1808 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Villages & Countrysides (Russia)
1815 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - L�beck & Bremen
1815 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Franconia, Swabia & Bavaria
1820 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bremen
1843 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Russian Border Austria & Prussia
1862 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Areas in the U.S. under General Grant's Jurisdiction[1]
1866 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Galatz, Romania
1880s - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Russia
1891 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Moscow
1919 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bavaria (foreign born Jews)
1938-45 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Nazi Controlled Areas
1948 -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Arab Countries

[quirk]

109 Locations whence Jews have been Expelled since AD250

So?

[An Céachta Dearg]

109 Locations whence Jews have been Expelled since AD250


Whats your point?

[Al Fatiha]

So?Easy!

Everywhere the Jews go, they infiltrate the government, banking system, legal system, and have an agende to take over the country they live in.

America is currently experiancing their own version of ZOG.

Many countries have had to throw off their Jewish masters and regain their nation and culture back.

Germany was just one in a long line of countries to rid it's self of this Jewish plague.

[miriya]

How cant they be a plague, they follow the word of God dont they?

[quirk]

Catch a grip. Your an intelligent poster you should know better than to believe these right wing conspiracy theories.

[An Céachta Dearg]

Easy!

Everywhere the Jews go, they infiltrate the government, banking system, legal system, and have an agende to take over the country they live in.

America is currently experiancing their own version of ZOG.

Many countries have had to throw off their Jewish masters and regain their nation and culture back.

Germany was just one in a long line of countries to rid it's self of this Jewish plague.

So pople of one religion rganise themselves like Ants in the take over of foreign countries.

Countries had to throw off their Jewsih masters, I never of such crap Al. Tak for instance Disraeli a 19th century Prime Minister of Britian who had to convert from Juduaism from Christianity to take a job he was democratically 3lected to do. !!!

On this argument faults are many. The Jews have never pressed their religion on anyone whereas both Christians and Muslims ave slaughtered millions for being either Heathens or Infidels and not converting

[Al Fatiha]

Catch a grip. Your an intelligent poster you should know better than to believe these right wing conspiracy theories.Thanks for the compliment!


But in America, the Jews control the banking system and financial system.

Jews own and control almost all of the media.

And the legal system is Jewish dominated.

[ciaranxavier]

since my words offend you are all these pictures just lies? this is labor camps too you? and i found these pictures in 45 seconds i wonder what a thorough search could bring up.

http://markgorman.files.wordpress.com/2007/11/holocaust00_1.jpg

http://z.about.com/d/history1900s/1/0/d/8/einsatz7.jpg

http://www.martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/babiyar.jpg

http://www.ethicalatheist.com/img/dachau_gas_chambers.jpg

http://www.deathcamps.org/gas_chambers/pic/bigstutthofgc.jpg

http://www.eastrenfrewshire.gov.uk/10248.jpg

http://www.erichufschmid.net/111-SC-203461_Buchenwald_ovens_14April1945.jpg

[Al Fatiha]

At the most there are a couple of hundred bodies in the pictures.


Again, there were "some" people exterminated and buried in pits.

But far, far less than 6 million.

[Gareth]

How cant they be a plague, they follow the word of God dont they?

They are regarded as a blessing according to Genesis and I'd be inclined to agree with this.

[Al Fatiha]

They are regarded as a blessing according to Genesis and I'd be inclined to agree with this.Most Jews are not religious.

If you go to Israel, you will see that it is a non religious secular society.

The blessings were for the Torah observant Jews. I would venture to say that is about 1% of all Jews in the world.

[ciaranxavier]

At the most there are a couple of hundred bodies in the pictures.


Again, there were "some" people exterminated and buried in pits.

But far, far less than 6 million.

thats 45 seconds of searching i could find more.

[Al Fatiha]

thats 45 seconds of searching i could find more.Can you find 6 million?

[ciaranxavier]

Can you find 6 million?

i doubt they photographed all the killing they did so probably not.

[An Céachta Dearg]

Can you find 6 million?

Can you explain where the 6 million who disapeared are gone?

[Gareth]

Most Jews are not religious.

If you go to Israel, you will see that it is a non religious secular society.

The blessings were for the Torah observant Jews. I would venture to say that is about 1% of all Jews in the world.

Actually in Israel 20% are secular. The vast majority of Jewry do follow Orthodox, Conservative or Reform Judaism. Some have come to Messianic Judaism also to worship the Messiah Yeshua.

[greektzon]

So Auschwitz was effectively a 5 star hotel for Jews then? Wow Hitler wasn't anti-Semitic at all then?

No Auschwitz wasnt a 5 star hotel,maybe was swimming pool
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4633/pool9ao2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
View of the swimming pool at Auschwitz 'Konzentrationslager' Camp.

So,if you ask me what was Aushwitz,i will tell you the truth.
I dont Know.

[An Céachta Dearg]

No Auschwitz wasnt a 5 star hotel,maybe was swimming pool
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4633/pool9ao2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
View of the swimming pool at Auschwitz 'Konzentrationslager' Camp.

So,if you ask me what was Aushwitz,i will tell you the truth.
I dont Know.

What point are you making?

[donquixote99]

I don't NEED to believe like you, just to believe.

I go by the hard core facts!

Unpopular, but the Truth!


Address the hard core facts of the Himmler speech then.

[Gareth]

No Auschwitz wasnt a 5 star hotel,maybe was swimming pool
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4633/pool9ao2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
View of the swimming pool at Auschwitz 'Konzentrationslager' Camp.

So,if you ask me what was Aushwitz,i will tell you the truth.
I dont Know.

What makes you think Jews got to use that pool? Nazi soldiers worked there also may I add.

[greektzon]

What makes you think Jews got to use that pool? Nazi soldiers worked there also may I add.

i dont think the german nazi accept to make bath there in Auschwitz.
My opinion of course.

[Al Fatiha]

Can you explain where the 6 million who disapeared are gone?There is no 6 million missing jews.

[LARKIN32]

What makes you think Jews got to use that pool? Nazi soldiers worked there also may I add.
how would you know..:eek:

[LARKIN32]

Easy!

Everywhere the Jews go, they infiltrate the government, banking system, legal system, and have an agende to take over the country they live in.

America is currently experiancing their own version of ZOG.

Many countries have had to throw off their Jewish masters and regain their nation and culture back.

Germany was just one in a long line of countries to rid it's self of this Jewish plague.

shut up you nazi bstrd...
do they say similar things in other states about other minoritys...?

[Al Fatiha]

shut up you nazi bstrd...
do they say similar things in other states about other minoritys...?

Why are yoy calling me a Nazi?

I don't support the Nazi agenda.

I was just discussing the validity of the holocaust.

[LARKIN32]

Most Jews are not religious.

If you go to Israel, you will see that it is a non religious secular society.

The blessings were for the Torah observant Jews. I would venture to say that is about 1% of all Jews in the world.and when had you last been to palestine...

[donquixote99]

greektzon, it didn't look just like a swimming pool to me. But it turns out that holocaust-history.org does have information about this installation. It's primary purpose was to serve as a water resevoir for fire-fighting purposes, but is was adapted for use as a swimming pool as well.

If it seems likely to you that it was for the use of camp inmates, there's little I can really say....

Text and a number of pictures are available on this page: http://www.holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/pressac/technique-and-operation/pressac0509.shtml

[LARKIN32]

Why are yoy calling me a Nazi?

I don't support the Nazi agenda.

I was just discussing the validity of the holocaust.because your comments could be that of a nazi...
what you said on this thread is out of order... why are you so bothered about jews?and to talk in the way you had shows a lack of humanity..you ought to get to know better amigo

[An Céachta Dearg]

There is no 6 million missing jews.

All public records show that there were 6 million jews gone. Warsaw shows a 90% decrease in the Jewish population from pre-war to post-war census.

It wasnt only Jews who weremassacred but also Romany Gypsies and European Muslims

[LARKIN32]

and leftwingers!!!!!:eek:

[An Céachta Dearg]

and leftwingers!!!!!:eek:

We'd be gone Larkin!!!

:p:p:p

[Al Fatiha]

All public records show that there were 6 million jews gone. Warsaw shows a 90% decrease in the Jewish population from pre-war to post-war census.

It wasnt only Jews who weremassacred but also Romany Gypsies and European Muslims

OFFICIAL RECORDS FROM INTERNATIONAL RED CROSS PROVE "HOLOCAUST" WAS A FRAUD!
RECENTLY RELEASED RECORDS, SEALED FOR YEARS, SHOW "CONCENTRATION CAMP" DEATH TOTALS OF ONLY 271,301 SIX MILLION JEWS DID NOT DIE; THE WHOLE CLAIM WAS A COMPLETE FABRICATION
For years, Jews have told people around the world that six million of them were systematically murdered in German "Concentration Camps" during World War 2. Anyone disputing this claim has been viciously smeared as a hateful anti-Semite. Countries around the world have even jailed people for disputing the claim that 6 Million were killed.

Here now, for all the world to see, is a scanned image of an Official International Red Cross document proving the so-called "Holocaust" never happened. Jews around the world intentionally lied for the purpose of gaining emotional and business advantages for themselves. They committed willful, criminal FRAUD upon millions around the world!

"The Holocaust" is the greatest lie ever told. Millions of dollars have been paid out to "holocaust survivors" and their descendants for something that DID NOT HAPPEN. THis is intentional, criminal fraud on a scale so massive as to almost incomprehensible.

"The Holocaust" is the greatest lie ever told. Millions of dollars have been paid out to "holocaust survivors" and their descendants for something that DID NOT HAPPEN. The claim of a "Holocaust" was intentional, criminal fraud on a scale so massive as to be almost incomprehensible.

I call for criminal prosecution of individuals and groups who filed false lawsuits to obtain holocaust reparations and financial damage awards, for perpetrating deliberate fraud upon Courts. I call for the removal of Holocaust references in History books and educational materials. I call for the removal of Holocaust Memorials worldwide.

It is long overdue this intentional fraud be halted and those who perpetrated it be brought to justice for 60 years of vicious lies and financial fraud.

Previously the NSM has reported that the figure of the "six million" alleged victims of the "holocaust" actually dates back to an article in the Encyclopedia Britannica in 1902.

www.nsm88.org/articles/holocaust

[An Céachta Dearg]

OFFICIAL RECORDS FROM INTERNATIONAL RED CROSS PROVE "HOLOCAUST" WAS A FRAUD!
RECENTLY RELEASED RECORDS, SEALED FOR YEARS, SHOW "CONCENTRATION CAMP" DEATH TOTALS OF ONLY 271,301 SIX MILLION JEWS DID NOT DIE; THE WHOLE CLAIM WAS A COMPLETE FABRICATION
For years, Jews have told people around the world that six million of them were systematically murdered in German "Concentration Camps" during World War 2. Anyone disputing this claim has been viciously smeared as a hateful anti-Semite. Countries around the world have even jailed people for disputing the claim that 6 Million were killed.

Here now, for all the world to see, is a scanned image of an Official International Red Cross document proving the so-called "Holocaust" never happened. Jews around the world intentionally lied for the purpose of gaining emotional and business advantages for themselves. They committed willful, criminal FRAUD upon millions around the world!

"The Holocaust" is the greatest lie ever told. Millions of dollars have been paid out to "holocaust survivors" and their descendants for something that DID NOT HAPPEN. THis is intentional, criminal fraud on a scale so massive as to almost incomprehensible.

"The Holocaust" is the greatest lie ever told. Millions of dollars have been paid out to "holocaust survivors" and their descendants for something that DID NOT HAPPEN. The claim of a "Holocaust" was intentional, criminal fraud on a scale so massive as to be almost incomprehensible.

I call for criminal prosecution of individuals and groups who filed false lawsuits to obtain holocaust reparations and financial damage awards, for perpetrating deliberate fraud upon Courts. I call for the removal of Holocaust references in History books and educational materials. I call for the removal of Holocaust Memorials worldwide.

It is long overdue this intentional fraud be halted and those who perpetrated it be brought to justice for 60 years of vicious lies and financial fraud.

Previously the NSM has reported that the figure of the "six million" alleged victims of the "holocaust" actually dates back to an article in the Encyclopedia Britannica in 1902.

www.nsm88.org/articles/holocaust

To be frank AL I dont trust your sources

[miriya]

Why are yoy calling me a Nazi?

I don't support the Nazi agenda.

I was just discussing the validity of the holocaust.

gays and lesbians are mentaly ill, and should be stoned, jews are evil, sound nazi to me

[Al Fatiha]

gays and lesbians are mentaly ill, and should be stoned, jews are evil, sound nazi to me
I never said Jews were evil.

Zionists are evil.

Big difference.

[An Céachta Dearg]

Zionists are evil.


First thing you've said that I actually agree with Al.

End the Apartheid State of Israel

[donquixote99]

I never said Jews were evil.

Zionists are evil.

Big difference.

Well, here's what you did say about Jews, not Zionists, in this thread: (message 58, emphasis added):

Everywhere the Jews go, they infiltrate the government, banking system, legal system, and have an agende to take over the country they live in.

America is currently experiancing their own version of ZOG.

Many countries have had to throw off their Jewish masters and regain their nation and culture back.

Germany was just one in a long line of countries to rid it's self of this Jewish plague.

So, given your belief that the evil Zionists should be kicked out of the current State of Israel (if you don't think that, say so), and your list of 109 other countries where the Jews have been kicked out, and your belief that the Jews are a plague, the question remains: where shall they live? Don't you believe they will misbehave intolerably wherever they are? Is there any "ultimate solution" available to this problem?

You can answer after you answer the question you've been ducking: doesn't Himmler's Posen speech amount to a primary source confession that the Nazi extermination program existed? Here's a link directly to the speech material: http://www.holocaust-history.org/himmler-poznan/

[Al Fatiha]

You can answer after you answer the question you've been ducking: doesn't Himmler's Posen speech amount to a primary source confession that the Nazi extermination program existed?
NO!

[An Céachta Dearg]

The your are fefusing to acknowledge fact

[Al Fatiha]

The your are fefusing to acknowledge factI disagree with what you call fact.

It's fact to you, but nonsense to me.

[donquixote99]

End the Apartheid State of Israel

Where do you propose to get a big enough army, or a big enough stockpile of nukes, to do it?

What I'm saying is Israel does not want to be ended, and they have enough power to make the cost of ending them prohibitive. BTW, I think yet another holocaust would be wrong....

Have you another alternative?

[donquixote99]

NO!

Why not?

>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<

[Al Fatiha]

Where do you propose to get a big enough army, or a big enough stockpile of nukes, to do it?

What I'm saying is Israel does not want to be ended, and they have enough power to make the cost of ending them prohibitive. BTW, I think yet another holocaust would be wrong....

Have you another alternative?
Hopefully, Israel will emplode from corruption, and the society will break down and descend into chaos. Allowing outside forces to take control of the land.

[donquixote99]

I disagree with what you call fact.

It's fact to you, but nonsense to me.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."
Daniel Patrick Moynihan


>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<

[miriya]

Hopefully, Israel will emplode from corruption, and the society will break down and descend into chaos. Allowing outside forces to take control of the land.

yea we pagans could use a country

[An Céachta Dearg]

Where do you propose to get a big enough army, or a big enough stockpile of nukes, to do it?

What I'm saying is Israel does not want to be ended, and they have enough power to make the cost of ending them prohibitive. BTW, I think yet another holocaust would be wrong....

Have you another alternative?


First of all I'm not an anti-semite. I do not propose another Holocaust Christ NO!

Through a political process that would have to involve the same powers that helped found and arm the illegal state that is Israel.

Through a peace process a place can be found in a reunified for the indignous Palestinians and the Jewish settlers.

A divided Palestine will only continue to cause war and hostilities in the middle east

[Al Fatiha]

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."
Daniel Patrick Moynihan



Your quote does nothing but call your so called facts into question Donquixote

[donquixote99]

Al Fatiha, unless and until you show steps of logic, that any fair minded and reasonable person can follow, that justify your reply of "NO!" to the question on the Himmler Posen speech, I will consider you to be 100% racist bluster, and 0% truth.


>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<

[Al Fatiha]

Al Fatiha, unless and until you show steps of logic, that any fair minded and reasonable person can follow, that justify your reply of "NO!" to the question on the Himmler Posen speech, I will consider you to be 100% racist bluster, and 0% truth.
[FONT=Impact][SIZE=4][COLOR=Sienna]



I am Not a racist, and have never been one.

btw How do you get racist out of what we are discussing?

[donquixote99]

First of all I'm not an anti-semite. I do not propose another Holocaust Christ NO!

Through a political process that would have to involve the same powers that helped found and arm the illegal state that is Israel.

Through a peace process a place can be found in a reunified for the indignous Palestinians and the Jewish settlers.

A divided Palestine will only continue to cause war and hostilities in the middle east

RP, if you can envision a process that will get the two sides to want to merge, God bless you. Otherwise, you're proposing creating (throuoh what would have to be a coercive political process) a state that will goven without the consent of one or both sides. When one people is governed by force by another people, that's callled oppression.

Really, your solution is implemented now, except you'd prefer it the other way round....

I propose a somewhat coercive political process, and a peace process, as well. But I envision a less radical, less ideal, but much more viable end state: two states. With huge reparations for the Palestineans, from both the Israelis and the Western Powers. No easily arranged, but a lot easier, and requiring a lot less coercion, than any scheme that requires the Israelis to give up soverignity.

[donquixote99]

I am Not a racist, and have never been one.

btw How do you get racist out of what we are discussing?

Your own words? Message 58, this thread?

>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<
>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<
>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<

[Al Fatiha]

Your own words? Message 58,

The Jews are Not a race. They are members of a religion called Judiasm.

There are white jews, black jews, asian jews, arab jews, etc.

[donquixote99]

The Jews are Not a race. They are members of a religion called Judiasm.

There are white jews, black jews, asian jews, arab jews, etc.

Mere semantics. Racist covers it.

[Al Fatiha]

Mere semantics. Racist covers it.Not really. You are wrong, but too dumb to admitt it.

[donquixote99]

Well, let's see. We have two theories here. Either you're racist, or I'm dumb.

The evidence that you are racist is your baseless animosity towards the Jews as a group. Anyone who thinks that a particular human group is a plague strikes me as racist. I refuse to switch to 'religionist' or culturalist' or any other odd term that may identify the basis of your bigotry more particularly; the distinction would make no difference. Besides, my theory is you are operating off instincts that serve to enhance genetic group survival, and so are acting like the Jews are a genetic group even if they do include diverse elements.

The evidence that I am dumb? Your turn. You might try, for example, showing me and everyone with pursuasive logic how I missed the glaring obvious problem with the Himmler speech evidence.....



>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<

[bay]

Thank you Larkin, RedPlough and DonQuixote99 for injecting some sense into this thread.

[Gareth]

The Jews are Not a race. They are members of a religion called Judiasm.

There are white jews, black jews, asian jews, arab jews, etc.

You're clearly anti-Semitic if you call the Jews a "plague".

[Viv]

One doesn’t need to hide a truth, it always finds a way to shine. In order to kill the truth behind the ‘Holocaust’ myth – Israelis and Zionist mafia around the world has come-up with various means to keep it shining – from mass propaganda through press and internet; Hollywood movies; hounding intellectuals who challenge their lies; Holocaust Education Foundation, which spread those lies in the US universities; free-trips to Holocaust museums and to Poland’s “Holy Sites’ - and putting western itellectuals who challenge this dogma into jails in France, Germany, Australia, Israel, etc.

While public schools in both the US and Canada don’t teach Christianity or Islam – public schools in several American States are forced to teach Holocaust.

http://www.ideajournal.com/articles.php?id=41

Another thread derailment in progress...moved from gay-bashing to Jew-bashing, Al Fatiha?:rolleyes:

What was the OP about again...?

[Al Fatiha]

Another thread derailment in progress...moved from gay-bashing to Jew-bashing, Al Fatiha?:rolleyes:

What was the OP about again...?The OP title is listed at the top of the page Viv.

You are the only one comming on the thread bashing and attaching.

Then you accuse someone of thread derailment. What a joke!!

[Al Fatiha]

You might try, for example, showing me and everyone with pursuasive logic how I missed the glaring obvious problem with the Himmler speech evidence.....



What is your hang up with the Himmler thing? Sure he disliked jews and wanted them out of Germany.

But he was just one of several nazi leaders.

You act as though his speech is some sort of smoking gun that is going to prove the whole holocaust fantasy is true.

[Viv]

The OP title is listed at the top of the page Viv.

You are the only one comming on the thread bashing and attaching.

Then you accuse someone of thread derailment. What a joke!!

Why are you not laughing then Al?:D

[Viv]

What is your hang up with the Himmler thing? Sure he disliked jews and wanted them out of Germany.

But he was just one of several nazi leaders.

You act as though his speech is some sort of smoking gun that is going to prove the whole holocaust fantasy is true.

What evidence do you have that the holocaust is fantasy? A picture of a swimming pool is not enough as compared to eye-witness testimony of survivors, thousands of pieces of photographic evidence, testimonials from troops who liberated the camps, physical evidence described by Enver.

What would you do with the Jews if you had power, Al?

[donquixote99]

What is your hang up with the Himmler thing? Sure he disliked jews and wanted them out of Germany.

But he was just one of several nazi leaders.

You act as though his speech is some sort of smoking gun that is going to prove the whole holocaust fantasy is true.

He doesn't just say 'we're getting them out of Germany.' He says 'we're exterminating them.' Read the material. It IS a smoking gun.

>Al Fatiha believes the Jews are a plague.<

[Phædrus]

http://www.youngwriterssociety.com/ywsblog/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/hear-no-evil.jpg

Hear no evidence, see no evidence, pretend to be horrified at how brainwashed everyone is.

I hope you see the irony, Mr. Hate.



This nut was already banned at Political Fever for trolling, baiting, and hate speech. Why you haven't done the same here is beyond me.

[Lightweaver]

This nut was already banned at Political Fever for trolling, baiting, and hate speech. Why you haven't done the same here is beyond me.

Comic relief?

His posts are so outrageous that they often make me laugh...:p

[An Céachta Dearg]

Hear no evidence, see no evidence, pretend to be horrified at how brainwashed everyone is.

I hope you see the irony, Mr. Hate.



This nut was already banned at Political Fever for trolling, baiting, and hate speech. Why you haven't done the same here is beyond me.

We do not believe in censorship here and try to defeat his views by way of debate. A much better method than Censorship.

[donquixote99]

Well it's a sort of debate I suppose....

NO!

We're getting right into Python territory lately.

"That's not argument, it's contradiction!"

"No it isn't!"

[An Céachta Dearg]

Well it's a sort of debate I suppose....



We're getting right into Python territory lately.

Well Don I truly believ that because only one word responses such as that in denial of the facts of Himmlers speach just prove that debate prevails.

would you not agree?

[An Céachta Dearg]

RP, if you can envision a process that will get the two sides to want to merge, God bless you. Otherwise, you're proposing creating (throuoh what would have to be a coercive political process) a state that will goven without the consent of one or both sides. When one people is governed by force by another people, that's callled oppression..

A state that is governed by one of both sides is not what I have envisioned. As an Irishman I know how a state in this regard works all I have to do is look North where the Unionists caused tyrannical oppression of the Nationalist population. what I propose is a federal country with all states having equal say in the parliament of the country and looking out for the needs of all the respective communities. This is the current system of Belgium and it acrtually works quite well there. I envision peace not war for the middle East.

Really, your solution is implemented now, except you'd prefer it the other way round.....

I disagree and I'm sure the Palestinian refugees who live in constant fear of Israeli air strikes and ground forces would disagree also. As we speak Israeli settlers are continually colonising within the boundaries set by the UN as Palestinain land. They do this by forcibly removing the locas from their farmland and livelihood through blackmail and violence..[/QUOTE]


I propose a somewhat coercive political process, and a peace process, as well. But I envision a less radical, less ideal, but much more viable end state: two states. With huge reparations for the Palestineans, from both the Israelis and the Western Powers. No easily arranged, but a lot easier, and requiring a lot less coercion, than any scheme that requires the Israelis to give up soverignity.


A divisioned state can never work. All you have to do is look at Ireland for an example where the North thore itself asunder after the unionists continually oppressed the Nationalist popualtion. Coercian is neccesary for the initial process but will eventually pay as both communities realise that they have much uin common and many common interests. The easy option as you have stated is the typical Colonialists viewpoint. Divide and Conquer. However This does not work. I do feel that Hamas(A secret product of Israels goverbemtn to undermine the PLO) have to be taken out and destroyed. But Fatwah can make peace with the Israelis and lead the Palestinians into a reunited Palestine.

[bay]

A state that is governed by one of both sides is not what I have envisioned. As an Irishman I know how a state in this regard works all I have to do is look North where the Unionists caused tyrannical oppression of the Nationalist population. what I propose is a federal country with all states having equal say in the parliament of the country and looking out for the needs of all the respective communities. This is the current system of Belgium and it acrtually works quite well there. I envision peace not war for the middle East.


I like your vision RP

[Lightweaver]

I like your vision RP

I have to keep reminding myself - RP on this board does not mean Ron Paul. :p

[An Céachta Dearg]

I have to keep reminding myself - RP on this board does not mean Ron Paul. :p


Being confused with American politicians is a new one for me:plol

[bay]

ROTFLMAO....

I'm just too lazy to type out TheRedPlough!

LOL

[LARKIN32]

AL FATAHI.......!!!!..(are you a muslim i wonder...stirring ??)

yeah well your re-using neo-nazi and fascist ideas to prove a widely heard and ridiculed argument about the holocaust... this as nothing to do with zionism.even though idiots in iran and isreal like to use this as an explanation to what is happening outside of europe ..it is nothing to do with it.jews,socialists/marxists/,The disabled,gays,the roma(gypsy)people wher all murdered systematically by the nazis etc.
it is a human issue,ofcourse many genocides have happened before,but to use a genocide as a political football,whichever way you look at it ,is fked up.
zionists use it this way.and rightwing idiots do as well,whatever religion,etnhicity they are.(??):eek:

[LARKIN32]

I never said Jews were evil.

Zionists are evil.

Big difference.
my above comment was in reference to this post

[bay]

it is a human issue,ofcourse many genocides have happened before,but to use a genocide as a political football,whichever way you look at it ,is fked up.


EXACTLY Larkin!

[Al Fatiha]

Well Don I truly believ that because only one word responses such as that in denial of the facts of Himmlers speach just prove that debate prevails.

would you not agree?The guy asked a "yes" or "no" question, so I answered him. What's the big deal?

[greektzon]

What evidence do you have that the holocaust is fantasy? A picture of a swimming pool is not enough as compared to eye-witness testimony of survivors, thousands of pieces of photographic evidence, testimonials from troops who liberated the camps, physical evidence described by Enver.

Yes,maybe you have right Viv.
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/3127/55157539xf6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/5459/58749927mx9.png (http://imageshack.us)
Maybe you have right.But why i dont see skinner people here?
They look fine i think.
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/3858/51212581rq7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
I dont Know,but....jews sent and card postal from Auschvitz?

[quirk]

Where are these photos sourced from? Looks like a movie to me.

[greektzon]

Where are these photos sourced from? Looks like a movie to me.
No,the links told for real photos.
But i will search to find the links and i will tell you.

[miriya]

Damm good diet
http://shalomrav.files.wordpress.com/2007/04/holocaust2.jpg

[greektzon]

Yes miriya i have seen this picture.
But why we have 2 different photos here?
One from you, with skinner people,and 2 with healthy prisoners?
Do you have the answer?
If you ask me ,no i dont Know.
But i am sceptistic person.

[bay]

testimonials from troops who liberated the camps, physical evidence described by Enver.

I used to be a newspaper reporter. I interviewed several WWII vets who talked about going into the concentration camps and liberating them. Every one of those men broke down and cried.

It was real.

the numbers may be distorted. All kinds of history undergoes rewrite. But the Holocaust did happen.

As Larkin said. It doesn't matter what side you were on, who the victims are, genocide is abominable and using it as a political football is unconscionable.

[ciaranxavier]

well if you need more greektzon i can show you more pictures of them starving. if thats whats stopping you from believing they underwent extreme hardship.

http://bennettkids.homestead.com/files/starving_victim_experiment_dachau.jpg

http://www.scienceclarified.com/everyday/images/scet_03_img0238.jpg

http://www.bl.uk/learning/images/voices/starving.jpg

http://www.national-army-museum.ac.uk/exhibitions/shortVisits/iconic/images/103760.jpg

http://www.wyolife.com/kerryfest/auschwitz%20prisoners.jpg

http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/holocaust/hol-pix/einsatz1.jpg

http://webpage.pace.edu/nreagin/tempmotherhood/spring2002g/children%20experiments.gif

http://webpage.pace.edu/nreagin/tempmotherhood/spring2002g/auschwitz8.jpg

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/Classrm.jpg
The inscription on the blackboard reads "The Jew is our greatest enemy, beware of the Jew".

[ciaranxavier]

heres some more in case you need more evidence to show it wasnt a happy time.

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/MedExp03.jpg

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/Auschw01.jpg

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/Belsen01.jpg

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/EG1.jpg

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/EG2.jpg

http://www.shamash.org/holocaust/photos/images/EG4.jpg

[bay]

NO human of any race, creed or religion should have to suffer like that ever. In this day and age, society as a whole should have advanced beyond such barbarism.

and for that matter, animals should never have to suffer like that either, but that's another topic that will get Bay wound up....

[ciaranxavier]

Yes miriya i have seen this picture.
But why we have 2 different photos here?
One from you, with skinner people,and 2 with healthy prisoners?
Do you have the answer?
If you ask me ,no i dont Know.
But i am sceptistic person.

do these pictures help your scepticism? oh and just because you cant see theyre skin and bones in your pic doesnt mean they arent, theyre wearing baggy clothes so its kind of hard to make a judgement of their physical health by just appearance.

[Gareth]

They should do, they are making me cringe.

[Al Fatiha]

NO human of any race, creed or religion should have to suffer like that ever. In this day and age, society as a whole should have advanced beyond such barbarism.

I agree Bay.

If those were actual pictures of innocent Jews. It was wrong and should have never happened.

Although, I only see a few hundred people in the photos and not 6 million.


But if the pictures were bodies of Homosexuals or Zionists. Then I couldn't care less. And the piles were too small.

[bay]

two wrongs have never made a right, al fatiha

[Lightweaver]

If those were actual pictures of innocent Jews. It was wrong and should have never happened.

Although, I only see a few hundred people in the photos and not 6 million.


What a silly "rebuttal." Would you expect people to try and pile as many as 6 million bodies into one large hole for a photo op? :rolleyes:

And whether or not the figure of 6 million is correct, the photos clearly show evidence of the abuse and brutality of the holocaust. This cannot be denied.

[An Céachta Dearg]

I agree Bay.

If those were actual pictures of innocent Jews. It was wrong and should have never happened.

Although, I only see a few hundred people in the photos and not 6 million..

Of course you only see a few hundred AL, these were some fo the people resuced from the concetration camps. The 6 million had already been murdered and their bodies disposed of by this point.


But if the pictures were bodies of Homosexuals or Zionists. Then I couldn't care less. And the piles were too small.

Just what were homosexuals guilty of?

These Jews were not Zionists but actually of European origin. They lived and worked in Europe and most had been in their respective countries for generations.

[Gareth]

The death penalty just doesn't work.

[Al Fatiha]

The death penalty just doesn't work.
Tell that to a parent who had a child raped, molested, and then murdered.

[An Céachta Dearg]

Tell that to a parent who had a child raped, molested, and then murdered.


People in an emotional state such as that should never be allowed into a decsion making process whilsth in that state. If we murder the purpotraitor of those henious crimes we then descend to their level and bring the moral fabric of our society down to their level i.e absolute barbarism.

[miriya]

"thou shall not kill"

[Lightweaver]

If we murder the purpotraitor of those henious crimes we then descend to their level and bring the moral fabric of our society down to their level i.e absolute barbarism.

That's just one perspective. Another is that these people will never be able to harm anyone again if they are executed. I don't have a problem with it.

[quirk]

That's just one perspective. Another is that these people will never be able to harm anyone again if they are executed. I don't have a problem with it.

They will never be able to harm if they are in prison either. The death penalty is principally used as a deterrent which is shown not to work.

[An Céachta Dearg]

That's just one perspective. Another is that these people will never be able to harm anyone again if they are executed. I don't have a problem with it.

Removing them will not remove the hurt they have caused. If they are locked up then they can not do anymore harm to society again. Prison is there as a reform system and when properly implemented it is proven to work. To take a life for a life would prove nothing would as I have stated bring down the moral fabrication upon which our society is built. It removes basic human rights such as the right to live. Yes they have committed crimes for which there is no defence but the termination of their life is not the solution.

[Murgi]

I provided the link because anyone who challenges the Holocaust dogma - is immediately called "Jew hater", "anti-Semite", "self-hating Jew", etc. etc. However, according to Talmud - Whoever disobey Rabbis, will burn in Hell forever" - which could shut a Jew hacker.

Did you know that there are more Holocaust survivors now than at the end of WW II?

Read Teacher’s Guide to the Holocaust:

http://fcit.usf.edu/Holocaust/people/survivor.htm

A French Professor, Robert Faurisson, claims to have read thousands of pages of memoirs of World War 2 from Eisenhower, Churchill, and de Gaulle, and there was not a single word about gas chambers:

http://www.vho.org/aaargh/engl/FaurisArch/RF981020.html

Well maybe you and Professor Faurisson should read about the following people who are not Eisenhower, Churchill, or De Gaulle, but who certainly suffered in the hands of racist fanatics.

All of them survivors of the Nazi concentration camps. Read their names, research about them, and remember them.

Do not limit yourself to one professor and three men. There were thousands who survived and millions that did not.

Literature and publishing

Magda Herzberger - poet and author
Aharon Appelfeld - novelist and poet
Werner Barasch - author of Survivor: Autobiographical Fragments 1938 - 1946
Fanie Gusz (Fanny Goose) - author of Rising from the Holocaust
Marion Baumann-Parkurst - author of Searching Survivor and the answer I found
Louis Begley (born 1933) - U.S. lawyer and novelist
Bruno Bettelheim (1903-1990) - writer and psychologist
Thomas Blatt - writer
Tadeusz Borowski (1922-51) - Polish author
George Brady (Jiří Brady) - elder brother of Hana "Hanička" Bradová
Paul Celan (1920-1970) - poet
Yehiel De-Nur (1909-2001) - German Jewish writer
Charlotte Delbo (1913-1985) - French writer
David Faber - author of Because of Romek.
Leon Feldhandler - Organiser of resistance in Sobibor death camp, murdered after liberation in Lublin in 1945
Fania Fénelon - French singer, author of the book Playing for Time about her experiences in Birkenau
Otto Frank - father of Anne Frank, publisher of her diary
Viktor Frankl - Austrian psychiatrist and author of Man's Search for Meaning
Roman Frister - Author of The Cap or the Price of a Life.
Richard Glazar (1920-1997) - author of Trap With a Green Fence
Yosef Goldman - author and scholar of Jewish American History.
Fanya Heller - author of Love in a World of Sorrow
Eugene Hollander - author of From the Hell of the Holocaust: A Survivor's Story
Arek Hersh - Polish writer, author of A Message from History
Simon Jeruchim - French writer, author of "Hidden in France" and "Frenchy"
Alicia Appleman-Jurman - memoirist, writer of Alicia: My Story
Imre Kertész - Nobel Prize-winning Hungarian author
Gerda Weissmann Klein - author of All But My Life. The book was later used as a basis for One Survivor Remembers an Emmy and Academy Award winning documentary.
Jerzy Kosiński (1933-1991) - novelist
Olga Lengyel - author of Five Chimneys
Robert Maxwell - media proprietor
Filip Muller (born 1942) - author of " Three years in the gas chamber" survived Auschwitz
Arnulf Øverland (1889-1968) - Norwegian poet, survived Sachsenhausen concentration camp
Marcel Reich-Ranicki (born 1920) - literary critic
Vladek Spiegelman - subject of the Pulitzer Prize-winning book Maus
Mike Staner - Writer
Balys Sruoga - Lithuanian poet, playwright, critic
Corrie Ten Boom - Author of The Hiding Place-died 1987.
Stanislaw Hutyra - Polish gardener and miner. Born 1922 died 2000. Imprisoned in Dachau.
Elie Wiesel - Nobel laureate author of Night, as well as Dawn and Day. Survived Birkenau, Auschwitz, and Buna before being liberated.
Hannelore Wolf - author of 'I Will Plant You a Lilac Tree.Survived Lublin, Belzyce, Kraśnik, Budzyn, Wieliczka, Plaszow, Auschwitz-Birkenau and Brünnlitz before being liberated.
[edit]Music

Karel Ančerl (1908-1973) - Czech conductor
Nelly Ben-Or (1933- ) - pianist and Professor
Bill Graham - rock impresario
Olivier Messiaen - French composer
Władysław Szpilman - pianist and composer
[edit]Humanities

Emil Fackenheim - philosopher and theologian
Antoinette Feuerwerker (1912-2003) -French jurist and educator, member of the French Resistance
Władysław Tatarkiewicz - Polish philosopher
Jean Wahl - French philosopher
[edit]Mathematics and natural sciences

Alexander Grothendieck - mathematician
Władysław Ślebodziński (1884-1972) - Polish mathematician
Mieczyslaw Birencwajg later Menakhem Ben-Yami (1926-) - Israeli fishing technologist and ecologist
Liviu Librescu (1930-2007) - scientist and professor, died during the Virginia Tech Massacre while holding off the gunman to protect his students
Victor Moritz Goldschmidt - chemist
Walter Kohn - Nobel laureate in chemistry
Primo Levi - chemist, Italian novelist
Israel Shahak - chemist
Bruno Touschek - Austrian physicist
Georges Charpak - Nobel laureate in PhysicsSuperscript text
[edit]Medicine, psychology, pedagogy

Jerzy Einhorn - medical doctor, researcher, politician
Leo Eitinger - professor of psychiatry at University of Oslo, known mainly for his work on late-onset psychological trauma amongst Holocaust survivors
Berthold Epstein - professor of pediatrics from Prague, conducted research on Noma while at Auschwitz
Erna Furman - psycoanalyst, known mainly for her work on grief in children
Rose Warfman -nurse, heroine of the French Resistance, survivor of Auschwitz, lives in England
Eric Kandel - neurobiologist, Nobel laureate
Daniel Kahneman - psychologist, Nobel laureate
David Katz - psychologist
Henry Morgentaler - doctor and abortion activist, now lives in Canada
Karl Targownik - psychiatrist
Michel Thomas -- linguist, language-teacher, American CIC Agent, awarded Silver Star in 2004
Isidoro Franco Vabani - (1896-1976) optometrist[citation needed].
Joshua Howard Shrock - (1923-) Jewish Doctor[citation needed].
[edit]Theology, spirituality, religion

Jacob Avigdor - orthodox rabbi and author
Leo Baeck (1873-1956) - rabbi, a leader of progressive Judaism
Leopold Engleitner - Jehovah's Witness, religious speaker
David Feuerwerker (1912-1980) -French Rabbi, member of the French Resistance
Franciszek Gajowniczek‎ - Polish soldier whose life was spared by the sacrifice of Saint Maximilian Kolbe.
Lipa Goldman - Orthodox Rabbi
Adam Cardinal Kozłowiecki - Polish cardinal
Max Friediger - Chief Rabbi of Denmark. Deported October 2, 1943 to Theresienstadt.
Menachem Mendel Taub, Grand Rebbe of Kaliv. Survivor of Warsaw Ghetto and Auschwitz Death Camp.
Yisrael Meir Lau - former Ashkenazic Chief Rabbi of Israel, current Chief Rabbi of Tel Aviv
Jean-Marie Lustiger - Roman Catholic archbishop
Sigmund Sobolewski, Polish Roman Catholic internee at Auschwitz, subject of the book Prisoner 88: The Man in Stripes
Joel Teitelbaum - Grand Rebbe of Satmar
David Weiss Halivni - rabbi, Talmudist
Chaim Michael Dov Weissmandl - rabbi of Nitra
Ernst Wiechert - Catholic writer
[edit]Politics, resistance

Władysław Bartoszewski, politician and journalist
Léon Blum (1872-1950) - French socialist leader and Prime Minister (his brother, René, was killed)
Trygve Bratteli - "Nacht und Nebel" prisoner, (including at Sachsenhausen concentration camp), later Prime Minister of Norway
Józef Cyrankiewicz - a Polish communist political figure, premier, and Head of State
Ludwig Draxler, Austrian politician
Einar Gerhardsen (1897-1987) - survived Sachsenhausen concentration camp, became Prime Minister of Norway
Kurt Julius Goldstein - XI International Brigade, Buchenwald resister. writer and author.
Anna Heilman, conspirator in plot to blow up Auschwitz Crematorium IV, author of Never Far Away: The Auschwitz Chronicles of Anna Heilman
Zofia Kossak-Szczucka - Polish writer and resistance fighter, a founder of Żegota antifascist underground
Tom Lantos - Hungarian-born American politician
Paul Löbe - politician
Odd Nansen - architect and humanist, founder of Nansenhjelpen and UNICEF
Martin Nielsen (1900-1962) - member of the Danish parliament for the Communist Party of Denmark. Survived 15 months in Stutthof and 6 weeks of ensuing death march.
Kurt Schumacher (1895-1952) - former leader of the Social Democratic Party of Germany
Ota Šik, Czechoslovak economist and politician
Simon Srebnik - one of the two survivors of Chelmno
Corrie ten Boom - Dutch Christian who was arrested with her family and sent to Ravensbrück concentration camp for harboring Jews
Simone Veil - French politician
Rudolf Vrba - escaped from Auschwitz with Alfred Wetzler and gave the first detailed report about the workings of the camp.
Jack Tramiel - entrepreneur who survived to start Commodore Business Machines
Elie Wiesel - author (particularly of Night) and political activist
Alfred Wetzler - escaped from Auschwitz with Rudolf Vrba and gave the first detailed report about the workings of the camp.
[edit]Speakers and researchers of the Holocaust

Nelly Ben-Or - musician and Holocaust speaker
Philip Bialowitz- Sobibor escape participant; Holocaust speaker
Marion Blumenthal Lazan- speaker and writer
Hans Frankenthal - author and activist
Nesse Godin - Lithuanian speaker and teacher about the Holocaust
Karl Gorath - German homosexual imprisoned at Auschwitz
Elly Gotz - educational speaker
Leon Greenman - anti-fascism campaigner
Kitty Hart-Moxon - Writer and Holocaust educator
William Herskovic - Holocaust hero, philanthropist, Bel Air Camera founder
Miklos Kanitz
Serge and Beate Klarsfeld
Henryk Mandelbaum - concentration camp rebel and escapee
Jack Mandelbaum
Solomon Perel - mistaken for a German gentile and inducted in Hitler Youth, author of memoir Europa, Europa
Poldek Pfefferberg
Josef Rosensaft - business executive and leader of Holocaust survivors
Pierre Seel - homosexual speaker
Sigmund Sobolewski - Polish Catholic anti-fascist campaigner against Holocaust denial
Paul Spiegel - president of Germany's Central Council of Jews
Eddy Wynschenk - Holocaust speaker
[edit]Military

Tuviah Friedman - Nazi hunter
Witold Pilecki - Polish soldier, founder of the resistance movement
Tibor Rubin - Hungarian-born, American Congressional Medal of Honor
David Shaltiel - district commander of the Haganah in Jerusalem during the 1948 Arab-Israeli war
Simon Wiesenthal - worked to capture Nazi war criminals and founded the Simon Wiesenthal Center
Bjørn Egge - Norwegian POW, survived Sachsenhausen concentration camp, later general in the Norwegian Army and President of the Norwegian Red Cross.
[edit]

[donquixote99]

I agree Bay.

If those were actual pictures of innocent Jews. It was wrong and should have never happened.

Although, I only see a few hundred people in the photos and not 6 million.


But if the pictures were bodies of Homosexuals or Zionists. Then I couldn't care less. And the piles were too small.

AF, you're a bloody-minded hater, and I'll not dirty myself 'debating' with you further.

[donquixote99]

People in an emotional state such as that should never be allowed into a decsion making process whilsth in that state. If we murder the purpotraitor of those henious crimes we then descend to their level and bring the moral fabric of our society down to their level i.e absolute barbarism.

Agree completely, RP. Furthermore, I note that governments are frequently incompetent or corrupt or both, and in my opinion generally unfit to be trusted to deal life or death upon people. At least, if some is sent to prison, you can let them out later if it turns out to have been an erroneous or wrongful prosecution. Digging up a corpse later is of no benefit at all.

[bay]

At least, if some is sent to prison, you can let them out later if it turns out to have been an erroneous or wrongful prosecution. Digging up a corpse later is of no benefit at all.

my sentiments exactly. You can always let someone out of prison, but you can't breathe life into him again.

[greektzon]

I dont denay the Holocaust of course.
But i am skeptistic person.

''800 Jews Lived Through Holocaust In A Berlin Hospital.

Klaus Zwilsky, 74, of Calvert County MD, is a Holocaust survivor.
He was not sent to a concentration camp, nor did he spend World War II hiding in the home of a sympathtic non-Jew.
Instead, Zwilsky survived in a Jewish hospital in Berlin, with the knowledge, and consent, of the Nazi government.
Zwilsky is one of twenty who were interviewed for Daniel B. Silver's book "Refuge in Hell: How Berlin's Jewish Hospital Outlasted the Nazis."
The book details how the 800 or so Jews living in the hospital managed to survive in the capital of Nazi Germany.
Causes range from bureaucratic infighting to German leader Adolf Hitler's ambivalence about how to handle Jews of German descent to the simple fact that the Nazis needed a place to treat Jews.

They did not know at this time that places like Theresienstadt were not relocation camps but places for Jews to be held before they were sent to their death at another location.
Zwilsky and his family did not learn about many of these things until after the war.
"We didn't know at the time," he said, that the Nazis were systematically executing Jews. "You find out all these things afterwards."
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/1774/olokavtoma2on8br8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

.....Berlin's jews hospital.....interesting...

[greektzon]

Celebrating a Jewish wedding in Westerbork 'Konzentrationslager' Camp, Holland.
http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/1041/85681911mr5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[mickyk200]

Celebrating a Jewish wedding in Westerbork 'Konzentrationslager' Camp, Holland.
http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/1041/85681911mr5.jpg (http://imageshack.us):confused:

[quirk]

This seems to be one of the many propaganda shots which the Nazis took in the camps or had people pose for. Kind of like when you go to North Korea these days you will be escorted to a model village where everyone has everything they want. But its all put on.

[mickyk200]

This seems to be one of the many propaganda shots which the Nazis took in the camps or had people pose for. Kind of like when you go to North Korea these days you will be escorted to a model village where everyone has everything they want. But its all put on.
Damages your pro-communist stance quirk but I admire your honesty.

[quirk]

Damages your pro-communist stance quirk but I admire your honesty.

North Korea isnt communist.

[mickyk200]

North Korea isnt communist.
Ah of course. Communism has never existed. Excuse my ignorence.
What about Dubcek's take on socialism? Was that closer to your leftist Utopia?

[quirk]

What do you mean my utopia. You have read Marx so I am sure you know communism is the definition of a classless society. It wont be utopian but it will be classless and stateless and this is something North Korea is certainly not.

It also isnt socialist for many reasons as there is a group at the top of society who rule over the masses.

[ciaranxavier]

This seems to be one of the many propaganda shots which the Nazis took in the camps or had people pose for. Kind of like when you go to North Korea these days you will be escorted to a model village where everyone has everything they want. But its all put on.

its just another poor attempt by greektzon to justify the holocaust and portray it as something good. i mean anyone who thinks being in a camp is a good thing seriously needs to be put in one themselves. yes greektzon i do believe you should be thrown in a camp so you can see how "happy" everyone was.

[greektzon]

its just another poor attempt by greektzon....

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/06/world/middleeast/06stalags.html?_r=3&ref=world&oref=slogin&oref=slogin&oref=slogin


It was one of Israel’s dirty little secrets. In the early 1960s, as Israelis were being exposed for the first time to the shocking testimonies of Holocaust survivors at the trial of Adolf Eichmann, a series of pornographic pocket books called Stalags, based on Nazi themes, became best sellers throughout the land.
Read under the table by a generation of pubescent Israelis, often the children of survivors, the Stalags were named for the World War II prisoner-of-war camps in which they were set.
The books told perverse tales of captured American or British pilots being abused by sadistic female SS officers outfitted with whips and boots.
The plot usually ended with the male protagonists taking revenge, by raping and killing their tormentors.

After decades in dusty back rooms and closets, the Stalags, a peculiar Hebrew concoction of Nazism, sex and violence, are re-emerging in the public eye.
And with them comes a rekindled debate on the cultural representation here of Nazism and the Holocaust, and whether they have been unduly mixed in with a kind of sexual perversion and voyeurism that has permeated even the school curriculum.
“I realized that the first Holocaust pictures I saw, as one who grew up here, were of naked women,” said Ari Libsker, whose documentary film “Stalags: Holocaust and Pornography in Israel” had its premiere at the Jerusalem Film Festival in July and is to be broadcast in October and shown in movie theaters.
“We were in elementary school,” he noted. “I remember how embarrassed we were.”

Hanna Yablonka, a professor of history at Ben-Gurion University of the Negev, says the film highlights what she calls the “yellow aspects of nurturing the memory of the Holocaust.”
“Are we taking it into the realm of semipornography?” she asked. “The answer is, we are.”
The Stalags were practically the only pornography available in the Israeli society of the early 1960s, which was almost puritanical.
They faded out almost as suddenly as they had appeared.
Two years after the first edition was snatched up from kiosks around the central bus station in Tel Aviv, an Israeli court found the publishers guilty of disseminating pornography.
The most famous Sta